Liberal or Conservative views?

This issue is probably too massive for me to even truly touch on in one post on the forums, but I'll try my very hardest.

What are your views? Are you a liberal, or a conservative? State why.

In my country, I don't give a shit because all the parties are basically exactly the same damn things. And Canadian politics is hella boring and unimportant.

Regarding American politics, I definitely take a stance on the democrat side. I think that the fundamentals Obama stands for are just.

Free health care should in my opinion be a necessity to a thriving country. Canada has had it for almost 80 years now, I could never imagine living without it. Paying a little extra in tax isn't such a big deal anyways, and everyone gets hurt occasionally, so you'll be glad not to worry about it.

Pulling out of Iraq is also important in my opinion. America got there and did what they needed to do. The fact that they took so many lives and found no weapons of mass destruction should have signaled an immediate end to the campaign there in my opinion. America is already bankrupt anyways, they can't afford and should not be funding more militaristic operations.

Oh one thing more, gun laws. I don't think people need guns. I know it's a sport, I just don't think that matters. Canada has way, way less gun crime per 100,000 than America, because we have gun laws. I know they're cool and fun and shit and that there are other things that can be used as weapons, but guns represent more than just a weapon. They're a fear regime within themselves. Guns mean you have power. The media helps by specifically pointing out gun related crimes and such. A knife can be used to kill, but a gun is not only more effective, it's a scare tool and can be used at a range and somewhat covertly. Less guns = less murders, this has only been shown in basically every country that disallows guns.

Come on pulp, your thoughts please. Remember, don't be rude and don't insult anybody else's values and beliefs. Legitimate debate only.

The county I live in, Sonoma County, is the most liberal county in California, and California is the most liberal state in the union. I, myself, have learned that I am a Republican with Democratic views, i.e pro-life, for gay marriage, etc. Honestly, I think Republicans are all very close minded individuals who only consider how politics directly affect the lives of others and how they affect their sentimental views. Democrats, to contrast, are open-minded and are very willing to change; they see the big picture and how it affects everyone's well being.

I am not bashing, I respect all view points, and would like for everyone to have their own. In the end, it doesn't affect me, so I truly don't give a flying fuck.

2¢

ninji wrote:I truly don't give a flying fuck.

Sounds like a moderate to me. I'm moderate liberal myself, but politicians are all monkeys dancing for votes rather than coin.

I think that no one should align with a "side" when it comes to some issues.

Most people have no idea what they are talking about when it comes to many issues. It’s not their fault, but the sheer amount of information needed to become knowledgeable about every subject is enormous. It is much easier, however to become extremely knowledgeable and passionate about a single issue. These “single issue voters” align themselves automatically with whatever main political party supports their stance on that particular issue. These people are the sheep. They accept whatever their party tells them because they think “well, if they got that one issue right, they must be right about everything!” regardless to logic and reasoning. You see these people make fools of themselves at “tea party rallies” and political demonstrations.

By not aligning with a party, a person’s views remain purely theirs (to an extent). By not trying to fit in, opinions remain untainted. This is how it should be. Propaganda is effective because of alliance. Without alliance to a party; lies are not eagerly accepted as truth, those in power are questioned rather than blindly followed, and those that truly deserve to lead are given the possibility to rather than the whole election process being a popularity contest.

Bipartisan politics was a bad move. Each side yells at each other until they get what they want, and when they don't get what they want, they hurt the other side until they give. This is not the ideal democracy, it’s a bunch of pre-pubescent siblings arguing over who gets to drive the car next.


My final stance? I do not wholly align myself with any political ideology because I do not wholly agree with any one political ideology. I may agree with some points some parties make, but there is always something we disagree on.

exactly

So when it comes to these things, I lean more to the Republican side. Not so much that I'm going to be some old close-minded fuck who will only vote for a republican even if he's Hitler.

I don't agree with Obama's economy plans. Some of it is bullshit, straight up. Some of his plans and views are good. Free health care is deserved I think, but I don't believe that now was the best time to try and set it up.

As for gun laws, I completely disagree with Greezy. If you make guns illegal, the people who want guns to do bad nasty things will still be able to get them. I wish I had my friend Dan's packet against gun control. He had a pretty solid point for why it's bad. Off of the top of my head, it showed many countries banning guns, and then several groups of citizens being killed because they could not defend themselves. You can't stop the black market. Today there are people around that have weapons that are illegal, fully automatic assault rifles. They got them illegally, and guess what, if they're already illegal, what's gonna happen if you illegalize all guns? People will still get guns illegally if they need them.

I never understood American politics to begin with. It's either left or right, nothing in between. Anyway I consider myself a socialist in Dutch politics and as for my answers on some of the top issues in the US...

-Abortion
I think people should be able to decide for themselves if they want it or not. Sometimes abortion is just necessary (teen moms, rape, unable to raise a child) although I would promote adoption.

-Religion
Everyone should be allowed to believe or not to believe in the religion they want as long as they don't force them on other people or if certain items are against the law. I also strongly believe that church and state should be and remain separate, this includes the whole God thing on money and when taking oaths. Makes me feel discriminated as a non-believer.

-Social security
The government should always be there to support their citizens. This includes forcing everyone to have (free/cheap) health care, unemployment insurance, scholarship loans/insurance and disability insurance. Of course this isn't enough as this would make a lot of people lazy, therefor the government should also help with the reintegration of a person by providing opportunities for a new job or education.

-Scientific research
Nothing should get in the way of science except for a dangerous projects and yes this means I am in favor of stem cell research.

-Immigrants
They are welcome to stay/life here if they learn to speak the language of said country (English in this case) and learn to respect the culture. As for refugees from war zones etc, they should be taught to speak the language and trained/schooled so they can actually work and understand others. Again, guidance is important for a decent social integration.

-Iraq/Afghanistan
You started it why not finish it? I'm just happy the Dutch troops are coming home since they shouldn't had been there in the first place... (anti useless wars)

-Guns
Banning them wont solve a thing so why not regulate? Like I posted in another topic we have a nice Gun Law here in the Netherlands that bans heavy power weapons and makes it harder to own a gun so not every whackjob can get one and start shooting everyone at his school (to soon?).

-Drugs
If I have learned one thing from being Dutch it is that our drug system works. We ban heavy drugs (although I disagree on some drugs on the list) and regulate the rest; selling them in our famous coffeeshops and having points where people can test others so they are sure it is good stuff.

-Economy
Never looked into the American economy except for the fact that they caused the current recession because the banks decided to go ego-tripping...

I can agree with everything Epps just said.

Epps wrote:-Abortion
-Religion
-Social security
-Scientific research
-Immigrants
-Iraq/Afghanistan
-Guns
-Drugs
-Economy

Agreed to the maximum.

hyce777 wrote:So when it comes to these things, I lean more to the Republican side. Not so much that I'm going to be some old close-minded fuck who will only vote for a republican even if he's Hitler.

I don't agree with Obama's economy plans. Some of it is bullshit, straight up. Some of his plans and views are good. Free health care is deserved I think, but I don't believe that now was the best time to try and set it up.

As for gun laws, I completely disagree with Greezy. If you make guns illegal, the people who want guns to do bad nasty things will still be able to get them. I wish I had my friend Dan's packet against gun control. He had a pretty solid point for why it's bad. Off of the top of my head, it showed many countries banning guns, and then several groups of citizens being killed because they could not defend themselves. You can't stop the black market. Today there are people around that have weapons that are illegal, fully automatic assault rifles. They got them illegally, and guess what, if they're already illegal, what's gonna happen if you illegalize all guns? People will still get guns illegally if they need them.

I'm only speaking from experience. Maybe banning them in America won't work simply because of the surplus of firearms you've already created, but harsher gun laws here always result in less gun crime. Guns belong with the police, they will defend you. It's not simply just the banning of guns, it's also a two part operation where you crack down on existing illegal firearms.

-Abortion - I believe people have a right to choose. Sometimes it is necessary, and sometimes people are just plain lazy

-Religion - Being raised in a White Southern family, we were always big on religion. Now I'm not as religious as most of my family, but I do have a certain point as to where religion pisses me off. People have a right to choose, and when people try to force religion onto other people and their ways of life, that's when things go awry. Example, muslims in today's society are starting to become a real pain, especially in my area.

-Social security- Government should be their for their citizens. They've worked their whole lives, and deserve a reward. On healthcare, I believe Obama's plan and methods are fucking stupid as shit. Some fundamentals I agree with, but the way Obama is doing this just doesn't click with me. On unemployment, many people are taking advantage of this system. They're being lazy and stealing money from the hardworking individuals that truly need the money. ie veterans, disabled people, etc. Definitely need to monitor that a lot closer.

-Scientific research- As in stem cell research? I'm for it

-Immigrants- Now this pisses me off big time. Immigrants come here to this country, sometimes illegally, then try to force their fucking way of life on US! We have to learn fucking spanish in school, when it's them that need to learn the motherfucking language of the COUNTRY. I've seen too many times illegal immigrants disrespecting America, burning the flag. And that pisses me off. A fuckin lot. This goes back to social security. I've seen immigrants too lazy to get off their ass and make a living for themselves. Instead, they steal the government's money. But if an immigrant is hardworking, learns the language, and respects the culture of America, hey, welcome! In the immortal words of John Wayne, "This is America, I shouldn't have to press 1 for English."

-Iraq/Afghanistan- We started in Iraq, and now we're finishing. My brother is proudly serving as a Marine in Afghanistan, and doesn't know why. He's just proud to serve and defend our country.

-Guns- I own guns. My family owns guns. A lot. They have for some time. Hint to Obama; the last time the government tried to take our rights away, we had a Civil War. And a revolution. Banning guns won't do jackshit. Some people will say "oh, that's what the police are for!" I live in a rural area, and the nearest cop is almost 5 miles away. True, I live in a redneck state and redneck area, where everyone else has guns. I do believe that guns need to be regulated more , but if dumbasses decide to be dumbasses and hurt themselves, their fault. On hurting others, Ireally have no arguement. I just fuckin' love guns.

-Drugs- I'm all for medical marijuana, but other than that, drugs are a no-no. If drugs were made legal, cartels would resort to more violent ways to keep up their way of life. And cartels really fuckin' piss me off.

-Economy- I don't know anything about the economy. But we're in a recession. And money is tight. For now, I trust Obama to pull us out.

I'm pretty obviously biased based on the way I was raised, but oh well. Can't change my views.

im just gonna say that im a republican and thats it. i dont feel like writing another 3 page essay on my stance in government and politics.

You trust someone that greatly increased our countries debt in 18 months...

LieuTennet wrote:You trust someone that greatly increased our countries debt in 18 months...

Yep. For now though. We'll see where he leads us. He's losing my trust more and more every day though.

He lost my trust during the preliminaries -_- wait never had it...

judging someone before they've had a chance to prove themselves is not a good policy.

If you know anything about Obama it's okay since there is so much i disapprove of adding to the fact i'm a conservative and don't approve of most of the things hes done.

what worries me is the fact that your allegiance to a political party affects your views on others not in the same party.

He hides his personal history from the public, he was an active member of ACORN, he claims he isn't apart of the church with the guy damning America which he has been going there for a long time. Hes Muslim and is against America's roots.

now you're just trolling.

LieuTennet wrote:He hides his personal history from the public, he was an active member of ACORN, he claims he isn't apart of the church with the guy damning America which he has been going there for a long time. Hes Muslim and is against America's roots.

1) Obama is not a Muslim.
2) Muslims are not by definiton bad, mkay?
3) If by America's roots you mean stealing land from others and acting as if it's okay than please, take it away.

Sounds like you've been listening to faux news tennent

whos tennent? and It's real what i listen to.

Pretty he sure that by Faux News he means Fox News